What’s in a Name? A BATTLE
Did you know our former City of Fort William, with the help of our neighbours in Minnesota, had to battle Ottawa for the fitting name of the Nor’Wester Mountain Range? Read More Tartan colours
Did you know “The Famous and Ancient Nor’Wester Mountain Range” has it’s own registered Scottish Tartan? http://www.tartanregister.gov.uk/tartanDetails.aspx?ref=3146
Visual Impacts
Thousands of visitors come to Thunder Bay each year enjoy our stunning views and tranquil landscape. The Beautiful Norwester Mountain Escarpment welcomes visitors from the south via highway 61, and is one of first that passengers experience arriving by air.
“A scenic gateway to Canada as the home of the Pigeon River Border crossing, the Municipality of Neebing offers spectacular views of the majestic Nor’Wester mountain range.”North of Superior Tourism http://www.nosta.on.ca/ Municipality of Neebing
“Promoting our City’s connection to the natural spaces around us and our location on the Circle Tour is key to increasing awareness of one of North America’s most scenic coastal drives to the hundreds of thousands of avid motorcycle, RV and auto club visitors who continuously seek out new destinations based on exceptional scenery, culturally unique communities and winding highways.”City of Thunder Bay Tourism Newsletterhttp://www.thunderbaytourismpartners.blogspot.com/Posted by P A Pepe
The Nor’Wester mountains, like many other mountains or hills, offer a beautiful backdrop to our scenery. When something varies from the natural uniform of vegetation, it draws the eye, then becomes VERY NOTICABLE.
The initial development is for 18 turbines. (Shelbourne Ontario began with 20, now have 200!)
Flashing lights, 24 hours per day (remember our proximity to the airport)
Scale; Mountain 650’, Turbines 450’ SIZE DOES MATTER! THESE TURBINES ARE MASSIVE!
“Sensitive sites (natural, historic, recreation and/or scenic) should not be considered for wind turbines.” The Nor’Wester Mountains qualify in all areas. Jean E. Vissering Landscape Architecture 3700 NORTH STREET MONTPELIER VERMONT 05602
Tourism & Recreation
This area has traditionally been used for recreation. You can’t go far without seeing people jogging, toting skiis, carrying hockey bags, rollerskiing, hiking, biking. Do you realize that wind turbines will be placed 150 metres from skiers?
“Loch Lomond offers skiing, snowboarding and tubing. We are 10 minutes from Thunder Bay off of Highway 61 North on the majestic Nor’wester Mountain Range.”Loch Lomond Ski Area http://www.lochlomond.ca/
“This hotel provides guests with exceptional customer service, superb, full-service amenities and an unbeatable Nor’Wester Mountain location”Best Western Nor’Wester Resort http://www.bestwesternontario.com/hotels/best-western-norwester-resort-hotel/
“The Fort William Country Club is located in the City of Thunder Bay, Ontario and is Thunder Bay’s Premier Golf Course. It is a magnificent setting below the Majestic Nor’Wester Mountain Range. Every hole has a spectacular mountain back drop.” Fort William Country Club http://www.fwcc.ca/
Kamview Nordic Centre www.nordictrails-tb.on.ca/kamview.htm
VISITORS’ ATTITUDES TOWARDS WIND FARMS: A Case Study of the English Lake District National Park
By David Shepherd, Masters of Environmental Studies in Nature Based Recreation & Tourism, Lakehead University, Thunder Bay Ontario
Within the two last decades, areas all over the world have seen an increase in the number of wind farm proposals. To fully understand the potential impact that the proposed wind farms could have on an area, it is important to understand the potential human impacts as well. This study focused on visitors to an area which is known not only for its historic heritage, but visual aesthetics as well.
The study looked at three main areas:
1. The potential change in visitor return rates,
2. The level of general wind farm knowledge held by visitors
3. Visitors’ attitudes towards wind farms
This study developed a scale with a sole purpose of exploring the visitors’ attitudes, positive or negative, as the first step to understanding the effect that potential wind farm developments will have not only on the geographic landscape, but on the visitors to the area. This study found that as the level of general wind farm knowledge increased, visitors’ attitudes towards wind farms became negative. It was also found that the return rate of visitors would drop more then 8.6 %. This study showed that wind farms would have a negative impact on visitors to the Lake District National Park.
Liability & Insurance Costs
Opening up access to the mountain top will bring unwanted liability issues – Will this be the new dirtbike / snowmobile raceway or partypit for teens? Who will patrol these new open spaces? How safe will our children be?
According to CANWEA’s own documents:
The wind turbine owner faces a liability if his or her property poses any threat to the general public. Although chances are extremely remote, a wind turbine could throw a blade or the tower could collapse onto neighbouring property. In addition, because of its visibility, a wind turbine may attract unwanted visitors, especially children
http://www.smallwindenergy.ca/en/SmallWindAndYou/LegalRegulatory/LiabilityInsurance.html
Retirement/New Families & Recruitment Issues
Thunder Bay’s economy is moving away from resource-based economy to a more information-based economy. How will destroying our natural beauty affect our recruitment of professionals?
“Lakehead University is located in the heart of the city of Thunder Bay which is located in one of Canada’s most breath-taking locales. The boreal forests surrounding Thunder Bay constitute one of the world’s largest outdoor laboratories. The city offers a wealth of sport, recreation and arts opportunities. In 2003, it was named as one of the cultural capitals of Canada. The city has excellent skiing facilities (both cross-country, alpine and snowboarding), state-of-the-art athletic clubs, an indoor golf dome, numerous public golf courses, curling rinks, superb hiking and mountain biking trails and two Olympic-size swimming pools, including one on campus.”
Welcome Address – Dean of Graduate Studies, Lakehead University http://mail.google.com/mail/?shva=1#inbox/1249d2bad6070c3d
“Experience life to the fullest with our proximity to a variety of outdoor recreational opportunities. Camp, swim, ski, bike, golf, hike… you choose! With provincial parks, ski hills, miles and miles of trails and rugged beauty on the shores of Lake Superior, you are sure to fall in love with Thunder Bay. The city features an outstanding variety of recreational venues Health Care Recruitment in Thunder Bay http://www.thunderbayhealth.ca/play.html
Employment
- Any jobs created during the construction of this facility will be very short term. (Comment: the jobs are temporary – the changes to our landscape are permanent)
- Specialized workers hired to erect wind projects are usually brought in from elsewhere
- At best, only a few of fulltime jobs will be created by this project. Turbines are specifically designed to be low-maintenance.
Property Values
Are you prepared to accept a decrease in the value of your home - anywhere from 15% – 40%.
Turbines forever change the aesthetics of the land, giving it a more industrial feel. A view adds value to rural property. Take the view away – added value goes away.
Chris Luxemburger presented at an OMB hearing in Grand Valley , Amaranth and East Luther Ontario, area. 1) days on the market were more than doubled for those properties inside the wind turbine zone (3 Nautical miles)2) the sold price was on avg. $48,000 lower inside the wind turbine zone3) the number of homes not sold was 11% inside the turbine zone compared to 3% outside. http://ruralgrubby.wordpress.com/property-values/
The Committee of the Association of Danish Landowners, Danske Torpare, on behalf of it’s 10,000 members, decries property value depreciation by wind mills http://bjdurk.newsvine.com/_news/2009/05/13/2812772-danes-decry-property-depreciation-by-wind-mills-
WIND farms are blowing land values off course, slashing property tags by up to a third in some areas and lifting others by as much $50,000 per turbine. http://fw.farmonline.com.au/news/nationalrural/agribusiness-and-general/general/wind-farms-change-land-values/1359548.aspx
Would you live here? Daniel D’entremont was forced to abandon his home!!!
Barbara Ashee’s home in Southern Ontario became inhabitable.
Energy
Is all of this really needed or are we substituting one environmental problem for another?
Here are the REAL FACTS
1. The Power Is Not For Northwestern Ontario (NWO)
- We have 1535 megawatts (MW) of power available right now in NWO
- Minus Coal generating plants in Atikokan(227 MW) and Thunder Bay’s 2 units (326 MW)
- Therefore, we have approximately 1000 MW left without coal in NWO.
- NWO’s normal daily load (power used) is between 580 and 650 MW
- Even in the past, with all the papermills running, we used between 900 and 1100 MW.
2. NWO Has Too Much Power and Can’t Ship It
- New projects about to be added to the grid in NWO will add 480 MW’s
3.Thunder Bay‘s forcasted Peak Load (amount needed) in 2012 will be 455 MW
4 The Government WILL subsidize Wind Companies
5. The Government WILL NOT make a ‘MADE IN NORTHERN ONTARIO ENERGY POLICY’
- We in NWO produce power at less than 4 cents per KW
- We pay 8 cents per KW (no different than Southern Ontario)
- Government willing to pay 11.5 cents per KW to Wind Companies
6. In the past 18 months, the coal plants have run approx. 6 weeks
6. By 2014 NWO coal plants that are open will be converted to wood (carbon-neutral)
THIS IS NOT A WIN WIN FOR NWO!
THIS IS A LOSE LOSE SITUATION FOR NWO!
We are 100% against this project on the Norwester mountain range. The view will be destroyed. There are many many other places to build in the Northern Ontario with no people living around, build them there!
By: Brian/Lorrie Koopman on October 19, 2009
at 8:21 pm
You have our 100% support. Thunder Bay City Council should be ashamed of themselves. This is not a green environmental project. This is about profit and easy money. This is being done at the expense of our crown jewel the Nor’Wester’s, the local residents health, safety and investments (homes & property values) along with the detriment to our tourism, recreation, the escarpment environment and our future. To the Ontartio Government Environmetal Assessment Branch – please, stop this project and use some common sense.
Mauirce Poulin and family,
Kaministiquia, Ontario
By: Maurice Poulin on August 9, 2011
at 2:47 pm
We live in Northwestern Ontario, last time I checked, we are not short on space? Why in the world would we even consider putting something so ugly in our backyard? Can’t help but wonder why our city would agree & more importantly, what is in it for them? Run a power line into the bush & have at her! Do we honestly need to be looking at these ugly things? We don’t live in Southern Ontario where they have run out of choices people? Wake up Thunder Bay!
By: Dale & Cheryl McGinnis on November 4, 2009
at 3:59 pm
Proposed Wind Farm Norwester Escarpment
I attended the information session held last evening at the Nor’ Wester Hotel. I find it appalling that we would even consider erecting these ugly wind turbines in our backyard! Last time I checked, we are not running out of space in Northwestern Ontario, unlike our friends in Southern Ontario that likely have no choice in the matter. According to the presenters last evening, we have no need for more generation in Northwestern Ontario? Apparently we are not currently running the coal generating stations, we are spilling water at our hydro generation stations & currently building more I might add? Please help me to understand & try to make some sense out of this proposed wind project. I am confident this makes sense somewhere, is this right for us? If we do need wind turbines in Northwestern Ontario, run a power line into the bush where no one will be disturbed for goodness sakes, build 500 of them if you want, can’t imagine anyone objecting to the “Green Power” then? What would possess our city to make such a ridiculous decision? Like everything else in this world, comes down to dollars & cents I guess? I sincerely believe, we, the residence of Thunder Bay are selling ourselves short! Dear God; tell me this isn’t the best plan we can come up with for our gorgeous Norwester Mountain Range!
Dale McGinnis
By: Dale & Cheryl McGinnis on November 4, 2009
at 5:07 pm
Hi Dale, I’ll try to help you out with a little further information during your thought process. First, I would state that the fact that horizon wants to put the turbines on the Nor’Westers is a huge statement towards location of the turbines being very important. Although I don’t know the studies conducted to decide on a spot for development, it could very well be that the Nor’Westers offer a steady, powerful, reliable source of wind.
Secondly, in relation to power generation, according to the link below taken from the OPG website detailing all generating facilities, the actual generation capacity of NWO is 1199 MW’s.
http://www.opg.com/power/OPGmap0309.pdf
If you subtract the coal generation plants from that, you are left with 682 MW’s, which, if we are to attract more industry back to the region, is not enough power to sustain them, as this is close to the peak level stated on this website for daily energy use without the mills running. The coal plants are to be shut down/converted by 2014, so unless we want to be in NEED of energy, we have to find suitable alternatives.
Is wind power the right/only answer? Well, I would suggest that no perfect answers exist, but maybe it’s the better option compared to the alternatives.
By: Fitjarald on November 12, 2009
at 5:19 pm
We in north western Ontario have been pushed around by Toronto and the Liberal governments for far too long. We can lump this endeavour in with many of the other unnecessary “southern Ontario” initiatives, such as banning the spring bear hunt, the requirement for a power boat operator’s permit and the infamous long gun registry. The only difference is that it’s government subsidized rather than being passed as a bogus law.
We in the north have suffered far too long from the whimsical decisions that politicians have carried through as a result of pressure from completely uninformed citizens of the greater Toronto area and surrounding population.
Personally, I’m sick and tired of the south calling all the shots and forcing needles and useless restrictions on the rest of the province.
This windmill project is headquartered where? Toronto maybe? Who will be benefitting from installing them? Not us. How much work for local people will there be? Once the installation is finished, I doubt there will be much.
I recommend that they install the windmills on the tops of the tall buildings in downtown Toronto. God knows that there’s plenty of wind there. If they do, they’ll directly benefit from having a “clean” power supply right in their own back yard .
By: Don on November 10, 2009
at 2:41 am
You sound like an entirely discontent citizen. Perhaps you should move?
By: Ostracized on November 12, 2009
at 5:21 pm
Ostracized or Fitjarald, which one are you? You should stick to one username to avoid confusion to our readers. Thank you for your interest and comments on this site. This forum however, is intended to invoke some intelligent and mature discussion on the issue. Comments such as your are becoming more of a bully type nature will not be tolerated.
By: norwesterescarpment on November 16, 2009
at 12:51 am
“You sound like an entirely discontent citizen. Perhaps you should move?”
You’re right. Maybe I should move. I left southern Ontario many, many years ago to live here in Northwestern Ontario. This area offered me a life style that is envied my many.
My discontentment is from the encroaching activities and policies being fermented by uninformed urban lobbyists and half baked politicians in the large metropolitan areas of the province then forced down our throats. We live a different life style here in the north west. If my opinion is different than yours, so be it.
Despite the fact that your position in this debate appears to be very much in the minority, and contrary to the thoughts and concerns of the preponderance of posters, no one is suggesting that you move.
Your latest comment has revealed quite a bit about yourself.
By: Don on November 19, 2009
at 11:32 pm
Make sure everybody today takes the online poll at Thunder Bay post. Bottom
right corner.
Tuesday Dec 8/09
Thanks
Brian Koopman
http://www.tbnewswatch.com/
By: Brian Koopman on December 8, 2009
at 5:06 pm
Considering the expense of IWTs they do not make practical sense in most places and not just NWO. IWTs have no ability to replace reliable generators. Reliable energy sources with a total capacity equal to the maximum required must be in place when IWTs produce 0 and to shadow the up and down energy production of IWTs. Use of the reliable energy sources is more often than not considering that 30% of capacity is considered a good IWT rate of production. This declines with age and reliability of the turbine. Other industries cannot be sustained on a variable energy source such as IWTs. Meanwhile we can expect higher rates to subsidize this green energy illusion not in proportion to the energy produced.
By: Ralph on December 24, 2009
at 3:11 am
You people are all foolish, look at the benefits.
By: Mark on February 17, 2010
at 4:16 pm
Thanks Mark for your concise and informative comment.
By: norwesterescarpment on February 17, 2010
at 9:37 pm
As a Miinesotan who used to come frequently to TB, the first “Wow” moment came when I would see the Norwester Mtn. range. Hoito was another wow, amongst others, but, that’s another story. Since I received my one and only dwi at age 62, I’ll probably be ambulatory when my “sentence” is finished. Good luck! Save your Mountains!
By: Past visitor on July 28, 2010
at 2:49 pm
Are the Norwester’s an Escarpment? I didn’t think so, and did a bit of research. Here in Ontario we often hear of the Niagra Escarpment, which may be where the confusion comes from.
Escarpment is defined as “A steep slope or long cliff formed by erosion or by vertical movement of the Earth’s crust along a fault. Escarpments separate two relatively level areas of land.”
I always believed the Norwester”s were a mountain range… The committe should rethink its name.
By: Russ on August 26, 2010
at 7:48 pm
Yes, they are…and have been referred to as an escarpment for years. Take a drive through Blake Township; you’ll see mountains on both sides.
By: norwesterescarpment on August 27, 2010
at 2:37 pm